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ONLINE EXTRA: Making Disciples–An Interview with Ethan Magness

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by | 20 July, 2008 | 0 comments

By Darrel Rowland

His title alone””spiritual formation pastor””is enough to tell you that Ethan Magness of Mountain Christian Church near Baltimore, Maryland, does not hold a typical ministerial position. He is a leader in Mountain”s wide-ranging effort to make disciples and the primary author of The Walk, a 226-page book to help Christians grow.

Here he talks about some of the barriers and opportunities to making disciples in the 21st-century church, including the contention of some critics that too many churches are entertaining attendees instead of teaching them to follow Jesus.



Is the “entertaining rather than teaching” problem new?

I don”t think that the problem of entertainment is a new problem. As far as I can tell, there have always been church leaders who forsook their calling as prophets and instead pandered to the prejudices of the people. I imagine two churches in a medium-sized town. One preacher preaches long expository sermons recounting doctrinal details as the crowds nod along and then the enthusiasm rises as the discussion of doctrines turns to criticism of the church across town. At the church across town, the preacher tells wonderful jokes and everyone laughs and a few useful tips are offered to help everyone have a happier marriage. The band is sharp and everyone leaves feeling good.

In both those churches the preacher was entertaining. They serve different populations but they are both pandering. To resist pandering is a great challenge. I grew up in the rural Bible Belt. I visited plenty of churches that were pandering either through feeding the political, racial, or social prejudices or by promoting spiritual and denominational pride. This kind of behavior is nothing new.



Are larger churches with more new members more susceptible (the old “mile wide and an inch deep” criticism)?

I think that this is a grave problem. I do think this is probably a more serious problem in large and growing churches. In part this is a leadership issue. As the scale of the church grows, it is more and more difficult to train, equip, and coordinate leaders. In part this is a natural consequence of growth. Churches that are rapidly evangelizing new believers will necessarily have many immature Christians. The question needs to be not is a church deep, but is it deepening.

This of course is a high standard. To ask the question, “Is our congregation deepening?” is to open oneself up for serious introspection. Few Christian leaders I know could stand up to that question without some heartache and longing for more. That certainly is my situation.



Sunday school attendance (at least as a percentage of worship attendance) has been dropping for years, and Sunday night services are largely disappearing (at least for adults) . . . so how do effective churches teach their members and make disciples in the 21st century?

While I have not done independent research, it certainly does seem that the two programs you mention are on the decline. This is certainly not universally true. My previous ministry had a highly effective Sunday school that has continued to grow in strength. I know of very few churches that continue to have a strong traditional Sunday evening service. However, I do not particularly mourn the passing of these forms. All such forms serve the age and as the culture changes so must the forms. It is worth remembering that these two forms are relatively new in the history of the church and so we should not be surprised if they are replaced as the culture changes. If new forms do not arise to replace them, then we have a problem, but if new forms do arise, then we need not mourn; instead we can recognize that this is the natural life-cycle of church programs.



What is Mountain Christian Church doing to make disciples? (Magness responded by dividing this overall inquiry into three questions of his own, and answering them.)

How are we avoiding the temptation to pander?

First, we recognize that this is an easy and ever present temptation. As I said, I don”t think this is any more of temptation in churches like Mountain than any other church. The reality is that it is always easiest to tell people what they want to hear. So I think one of the most important ways we address this temptation is by developing and evaluating in a team format. It is easier to avoid pandering if there are many people holding each other accountable to the main mission. All of us lose sight occasionally and fall into pleasing people or charming visitors. In these moments we can remind one another that our task is to make disciples.

How are we developing an atmosphere of deepening in light of the huge populations of new Christians? (We are shallow but are we deepening.)

First a comment on depth. We often confuse depth with knowledge. When I am tempted to criticize a church as shallow, I must catch myself. Perhaps we should better understand shallow as a Christian who does not live out what they know. If this is what it means to be shallow, then I am probably more shallow than most of the new Christians in our church. This is why I prefer the standard of deepening. A deepening church is a church where people are learning more and are increasingly living out what they learn.

Mountain is filled with young Christians. So lots of people have a lot of ignorance. Consequently we have raised deepening (“growing” in our lingo) as a core value. We have done this by raising it as a value for our elders, staff, lay-leadership, and members at large. We are convinced that it is not enough to provide learning opportunities (whatever the forms may be) for those new to the faith. Instead we need a culture that assumes that all people are growing in maturity and faith in Christ. We are doing this by targeting our leadership. We have begun to emphasize spiritual growth with our staff and key leaders. We invested in a three-day spiritual retreat for all the staff and are developing an ongoing relationship with Emmanuel (School of Religion in Johnson City, Tennessee) to train and challenge our leadership at all levels. In all areas of ministry we are raising up coach-level leaders who not only guide in completion of tasks, but are specifically charged with developing discipling relationships with all the leaders that they serve.

I often joke that we are pursuing “trickle-down” discipleship. By focusing on the spiritual growth of our leaders and by impressing upon them their call to care for the spiritual growth of those they lead, we are convinced they will become equipped both to model and to guide others in spiritual growth.

How are we finding new forms to replace those forms that no longer serve our culture?

As I said (earlier), I am convinced most forms are culture based and consequently it should be expected that new forms will be needed in each new age. At Mountain our forms are trending in two different directions simultaneously. We are convinced we need forms that are large in scale and forms that are small. I will start with the large forms. Because our culture (both inside and outside of the church) is filled with an overwhelming array of activities, we have found that growing events need to reach a certain threshold of scale to even register with the congregation. A simple Sunday school class meeting weekly will be found only by those who least need it. So instead of classes we have events. These events have a broad enough appeal and are designed in such a way to create a recognizable entry point that can stand out against the noise.

Another way to achieve the impact of large events is by focusing energy in their direction. There is one first step of participation in Mountain. This “Welcome to Mountain Class” is the only public way in to anything. Now some people who know what they are looking for can get connected without WTM, but from the stage and in all official correspondence all new people are directed to WTM. This creates an easily promotable first step that gets talked about a lot. So even thought the event itself is not huge, it is repeated often enough that it begins to rise above the noise.

Likewise we are slowly focusing our energies around a single next step. This is “The Walk” class. This eight-week class is the single best choice for those who have taken WTM. In theory, at any other entry point, a person will be asked if they have taken “The Walk.” If they have not, they will be encouraged to sign up at the next opportunity. Again we hope that the consistency of message will rise above the noise. It is in this class that we get our best chance to teach the value and practices of a deepening faith.

So both by scale and in focus, we are trying to develop events that are large and thus can capture the attention in the midst of busy church culture.

At the opposite end of the spectrum we are trying to create events that are small. When people have stable relationships with Christian friends and family, I am convinced that Sunday school is a great forum for spiritual growth and development. Unfortunately most of our members do not have that. They need to be part of community that is small enough to replace those natural relationships. Small groups allow churches to provide a deepening environment that meets the desperate relational needs. We freely recognize small groups are less efficient as an information distribution method. But if deepening in faith is as much about life as it is about knowledge, then small groups have some important strengths that balance out this weakness.

We are constantly reevaluating the forms of our ministry. We do not take it for granted that the forms that serve today will serve us in the future. We expect that at many times, forms of ministry will overlap. It is not realistic to assume that any one form will meet all needs. The classroom form still serves us well, but neither the classroom form nor the small group are enough on their own.


Darrel Rowland is public affairs editor of The Columbus Dispatch and an adult Bible fellowship teacher at Worthington (Ohio) Christian Church.


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